Flesh Lives

Whatever you think of the politics of Lewisham's Transition Town movement, you can't deny their industry. They are involved in all sorts of wonderful and eccentric causes - including two local events addressing meaty topics:

Raw Like Lion, 21st January 2009
Deptford Deli 4 Tanner's Hill Deptford SE8 Start time: 6.15pm Cost: £2.50 includes Coffee / Tea and slice of cake
Numbers are limited due to venue size and entry will be on a first come first served basis.

Introducing the Raw / living Foods lifestyle, there really is more to it than smoothies n salads. Don't believe us why not come and find out! Amy from Raw Like lion will introduce Why Raw? and discuss some of the pifalls of even 'healthy' cooked food with a mini raw food preparation demo. You will be able to sample sweet treats like cake and chocolate as well as something savoury.

The Meat Licence Propopsal
6.45pm, Friday 29th January 2010
The Old Police Station, Amersham Vale, SE14 6LG

Artist John O'Shea introduces 'The Meat Licence Proposal', a project which aims to change UK law so that people who eat meat must ‘be equally comfortable with killing animals’. Under O’Shea’s proposed law, people would need a licence to be carnivorous, attained through slaughtering an animal.

On its trajectory towards becoming 'law' The Meat Licence Proposal' operates as a cultural probe and provocation and this journey is documented and played out as a discussion site online:

'The Meat Licence Proposal' raises important concerns about the apparent gulf between citizens and lawmakers and asks the question what if we had a different kind of law? Can law be considered a 'creative medium'? O'Shea will facilitate a discussion about DIY law making. Can citizens make their own laws? If artists enacted laws rather than lawmakers how would they differ? What is a 'law' anyway?

The session will conclude with a short interactive exercise where individuals will be able to go through a liberating process of developing and enacting their own laws!

48 comments:

Headhunter said...

What has happened to "recent comments"? It's gone

Hugh said...

Just to say hi, you've missed me.

Hugh said...

HH, we're back on the bike and feeling human again. Do you also go a bit mental after a few days away from the wheels?

Anonymous said...

Reference to Videodrome?
Or Fletch Lives (Fletch 2)?
or both?

Headhunter said...

Yes, I was off the bike for a couple of weeks after the crash in late Nov. Still not fully recovered, haven't been out on a Dulwich Paragon ride since mid-late Nov (partly due to the weather) but those 2 weeks on nasty public transport were awful. If I had to endure it every day I would move out of London and do something else.

Headhunter said...

So Hugh, you've take to using the royal "we" as well then?

Hugh said...

Course we have.

I missed the crash news. Bad one? Lasting injuries?

Brockley Nick said...

@HH - still there on mine.

@Anon - Fletch Lives. Originally thought about Spanish film Live Flesh, but thought the Fletch pun might be more likely to be recognised and therefore less likely to make people think of Hellraiser.

Wish I'd thought of Videodrome...

Anonymous said...

Thanks. Have to admit don't know the Spanish film, but Fletch Lives works for me.

Headhunter said...

Recent comments is back for me too now.

Hugh - crash was on Old Kent Rd at end of Nov. I was cycling up to the junction with Asylum Rd. I had a green light and was powering through at 20+mph when some eejit in a Ford Escort turned right to go into Asylum Rd across my path (from the other direction along OKR) so I slammed straight into the side of his bonnet, smashed his bumper, windscreen etc.

My hip is still damaged, having physio. I can cycle but can't even run a few metres for a bus without it hurting at the moment so running is completely out.

Had 6 stitches in my leg which got infected so was on antibiotics for 2-3 weeks, just come off them.

Bike is a write off.

Anonymous said...

Sounds nasty HH, how did the driver react?

Unfortunately this is exactly the sort of thing that puts me off the idea of riding a bike in London.

Hugh said...

HH, glad to hear you weren't killed - that sounds a really serious prang. Did the driver get any comeuppance?

I've become a lot more sensible and risk-aware in the past few years. Double lights on the front, reflectives all over and on seat post, yellow bag cover, yellow jacket, assertive riding, always assuming some chavscum with a taxi licence or the like will prefer selfish and dangerous driving to considerate road manners. It surprises me how few riders take the necessary precautions although I'm sure you do.

Headhunter said...

I didn't see the driver as I was busy lying on the ground waiting for the ambulance crew to whisk me off to St Tommy's. I spoke to him a couple of days later, he said he was glad I was ok (even though at that stage I could barely walk) but didn't admit liability, but solicitor I'm using to sort out the claim reckons liability should be pretty easy to proove (his fault).

Yes, it's made me a bit more apprehensive when approaching turns on left or right, you just never know when some tw*t is going to just pull out in front of you.

I've added a few more dayglo luminescent straps and reflectors to my gear since the crash and I put my lights on even in daylight (unless there's bright sunshine).

Problem is drivers often see cyclists and assume that you'll be pootling along at 2mph so they can just pull out willy nilly in front, unfortunately some of us shift a bit faster than that.

drakefell debaser said...

Under O’Shea’s proposed law, people would need a licence to be carnivorous, attained through slaughtering an animal.

Interesting. Why stop there though. They should break the license requirements down into sub types. For example you start off with a chicken license and progress to getting your beef license once you have mastered the intermediate levels of sheep and goats. Once done you can complete a sub license for game.

It would make going to the butchers (who would need the equivalent of a black belt) more interesting with only the hard core allowed to buy T Bones and the squeamish forced to settle for drumsticks.

Anonymous said...

Turkey twizzlers for all, it could be like cycling profiency.

Hugh said...

HH, to be fair it takes a player to cruise at above 20mph.

Welcome to the team.

Jon said...

What stupidity! Will we all need to work at a sewage plant to have running water and a signaller to catch a train?

Ed said...

I remember hitting 40+ downhill on my Marin in Devon many years ago; don't cycle anymore.

I'll Happily kill to eat meat...

Headhunter said...

Highest speed I've ever managed on the bike was 55mph on a downhill in Bedfordshire when I was in my mid teens. Don't know if I'd do that again, it hurt enough at just over 20mph...

Anonymous said...

DD - they do break down the licence into types: seafood, poultry and quadrapeds (not mention of the super-licence for cannabalism).
As a dedicated meat eater, I think it's a good idea. People who are happy to eat meat but not comfortable with the thought of animals dying for it don't deserve to get to eat the delicious, bloody goodness.

Anonymous said...

Sound like sucking eggs but you have to be really careful at junctions, powering through at 20mph might not be best practice despite getting you home quicker. Never assume a driver has seen you, a cycle going 20 doesn't give a driver much to look at.

Headhunter said...

It was on the way into work in broad daylight, but yes, you're right, even though I had right of way, you can never remove the idiot factor...

Brockley Nick said...

I may be doing the meat licence people a disservice, but I think the rationale behind the campaign is that if you make people confront the reality of killing animals, they'll be more likely to be veggie.

Not sure that's supported by the number of vegetarian farmers or abbatoir workers. I think most people would say that the French are much 'closer' to food production than the British, but they are far less likely to be veggie.

I speak as someone who lives with a veggie and who tries not to eat much meat.

Jon said...

I get their rationale, but the whole point of modern society is specialisation. Far better to show people things with a smaller carbon footprint taste very good (rabbit, mackeral, shellfish, tempeh, etc) as well as how to use the entire animal (eat the offal, use the carcas for stock then chuck it in an insulated compost heap or in a tank with crayfish).

Grew up hunting with my father for vermin control (Aus has big vermin) and for tasty things to eat as well as killing for food on military survival training, so know the sadness of killing to be linked with our evolution as omnivores.

Monkeyboy said...

Best not get too close to sheep, could be miunderstood.

Sue said...

Hi Nick
To clarify, these events are not being organised by Transition people, but by the Tasty Diners Club. It's just that the details were circulated by a member of their e-mail list.

Brockley Nick said...

@Sue - I know, they're just helping to promote it.

But thanks for the link.

quick brown fox said...

I am a meat eater with a growing concern for animal rights. The ideal for a farm animal, in my view, is to live in good conditions for a reasonable period of time, and to be killed quickly. Far better than what nature offers, after all.

I admit I would be squeamish about killing an animal, but I would do it if I had to, and can I see that meat-eaters should be prepared to do so in order to avoid the charge of hypocrisy.

On the same principle, vegetarians who eat dairy products should be prepared to kill male calves born to dairy cows, since these are routinely slaughtered at birth - a practice that causes anguish to many dairy farmers but which is an economic necessity. Ever since I learned about it I've had more pangs of conscience buying a pint of milk than I do buying free range chicken...

Anonymous said...

They're not necessarily killed for the sake of it. There's still veal! :)

BrockleyBiker said...

"Problem is drivers often see cyclists and assume that you'll be pootling along at 2mph so they can just pull out willy nilly in front, unfortunately some of us shift a bit faster than that."

Going to have to disagree with you there. As someone on two wheels with an engine it makes fuck all difference whether you are doing 2, 20 or 40, the bastards will still pull out in front of you. Being in a bus lane for example now adds the whole new excitment to a morning commute with the possibilty of someone deciding that the thing that have to more than anything else is to turn left into a side road across the bus lane without indicating or giving any indication of their whim. Great fun.

Hope you heal up fine. Tommy's is great.

quick brown fox said...

I know that's supposed to be a joke, anon, but the very reason for slaughter at birth is that dairy cattle don't make good eating! There are breeds that can be used for both meat and dairy, but the milk and meat is more expensive than the 'either/or' breeds, and we the consumer (and our delegated representatives, Tesco et al) aren't prepared to pay that little bit more.

Car N Vore said...

pssst anyone want to buy some dead flesh . . . best quality . . . fell of the back of a lorry . . . no licence needed . . . no questions asked . . .

Headhunter said...

Brockley Biker - Yes I've experienced the "turn left on a whim" thing. Not only across a bus lane but also when you're filtering up a line of slow moving traffic.

In fact not long after my crash I was just back on the bike again and cycling up OKR just before Asylum Rd junction and 2 police vans did exactly the same thing that the driver had done to me shortly before.

The road was completely clear on my side - there were no cars or buses and I was buzzing up the bus lane when I saw the 2 massive police vans moving to turn right from the other direction (into a turning on my left). The 1st van turned before I was near the junction so that was no problem but the 2nd pretty much basically tried to mow me down in an attempt to follow closely behind the 1st. I slammed my brakes on and the van finally did the same with very little space to spare. I swore loudly and the policeman at the wheel simply smirked at me.... Absolutely hilarious I'm sure... SHoulda taken the reg number and complained to the Police Complaints Commission or whatever it's called.

Headhunter said...

QBF - Talking of vegetarians who drink milk, plenty of vegetarians seem to be happy to wear leather and previously, use rolls of photographic (35mm or whatever) film (gelatin from boiled up cows is routinely used in production film).

Anonymous said...

More like long pig from under the truck.

Hugh said...

Anyone else ride in today? Freakin dire. May take the train home.

drakefell debaser said...

yes, I think this morning was the worst it has been so far. Was glad for the hot shower.

Lep Recorn said...

I cycled in today . . . the problem going home will be cold wet slush . . .

I avoid the OKR whenever possible anc ut through Nunhead to Peckham High Street then trough Burgess Park coming out near the Elephant . . . much quieter and safer . . .

Headhunter said...

Yes I biked in. In this weather the best thing to do is stick to the busiest roads as they are clearer of snow. I walked down Manor Ave and got on the bike at Lewisham Way and stuck to main roads all the way. Traffic was moving much slower so if anything it felt safer than it has of late. Only problem is that the bus lanes which were previously completely clear, are starting to get a bit slushy which forces you onto the main carriageway.

Hugh said...

Agreed. I nearly have a heart attack every time my front wheel (23C, 120psi) touches a lump of slush.

Headhunter said...

Mine are 700x23, was on 700x19 for a while, they were sooo narrow, people used to remark on them whilst I was stopped at lights. It was like riding on the blade of an ice skate! Just might give me that little extra bit of grip. I've got my tyres down nearer 100psi at the moment, I usually run them at 110-120psi though.

Pete said...

I rode in, my feet were in agony most of the way. Why on earth do my shoes have holes in the bottom? Not really what you want in this weather.

Headhunter said...

I've got neoprene shoe covers which help keep off the rain and cold a bit, but my toes certainly weren't toastie...

Hugh said...

I must be the only road bike rider working in the City who doesn't wear shoe covers. No offence but they are well gay. Unnecessary too. Just wear wool socks.

Pete said...

Well I had wool socks on and thought I was going to get frost bite.

back on track said...

Thought you guys had your own thread or something for bike stuff

Tom said...

on the subject of the thread ... I thoroughly recommend reading "Catching Fire" by Richard Wrangham for a comprehensive demolition of the argument that raw food is somehow healthier or more natural than cooked food.

There is simply no evidence this is the case. It is a recent (from mid-20th century) fad, backed by woolly thinking.

Indeed, if you believe Wrangham advocates of raw food are advocating turning our backs on what makes us human: cooking.

(Oh, and for the bike thread, I have neoprene overboot things, and while they look awful, they work.)

ill said...

I'm at home ill, having eaten raw foods, namely spinach which I evidently didn't wash in enough water.

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