Tesco plans for Crofton Park

A reliable (though admittedly single) source has notified us that Tesco has signed a 15-year lease on 437-439 Brockley Road.

Suggestions that Tesco is planning to occupy a site in Crofton Park have been circulating for months.

Developers submitted an application to turn 437-439 Brockley Road (opposite the Brockley Jack) in to a single commercial unit, which could house a small supermarket, similar to the Tesco on Lewisham Way. Those plans were rejected after demolition of the existing buildings had already taken place, with the Council deciding that the proposals would overdevelop the site.

63 comments:

From The Edge said...

This would make me very happy. Since moving to this part of Brockley, our food expenditure has gone through the roof, after having to resort to the Co-Op (which we have now abandoned due to their crappy quality and high prices) and then the Budgens down the road.

A Tesco would certainly be most welcome.

Anonymous said...

Have you not discovered Tesco online then?

Anonymous said...

I have to disagree. I was one of the many who petitioned to stop them previouly. It would cause untold congestion especially for those living on Sevenoaks road (this is already a problem with the wheel shop). We also have a fantastic shop at Budgens that is owned by a local and someone who inputs alot into the local community.

qbf said...

I agree Budgens is great; the staff are the friendliest and most helpful of any supermarket I've been to. This is typically aggressive behaviour by Tesco, taking a site within a stone's throw of two other supermarkets.

Brockley Nick said...

Anon, re: traffic. I don't think it will cause congestion. It's a small supermarket, designed for shoppers on foot. The one in Lewisham Way doesn't generate a lot of traffic and presumably you're not worried about all the congestion caused by Budgens and Co-Op?

Anonymous said...

I agree. Budgens is great. No need for another supermarket within a stone's throw of the other two.

Fattyfattybumbum said...

I would choose Budgens ANY day over Tesco and their pricing is really competitive. I regularly head down there for a box of eggs and leave with 4 bags of groceries!

Anonymous said...

Does anyone know if the Sainsburys at Honor Oak Park is due to be built?

Anonymous said...

The supermarket chain Budgens = good, the supermarket chain Tesco = evil. I'm not overly enthused by small supermarkets populating high streets but I've yet to see how people discriminate when dummy spitting. Is it because they are over an arbitrary level of success? Too expensive? Not expensive enough so squeezing other small but, but otherwise virtuous, expensive rivals? or is it a knee jerk yah boo?

Can some one please advise on how to decide and which ones are acceptable? Budgens is a franchise but that doesn't seem a good enough reason. Budgens will use its purchasing power to undercut smaller true independents so that argument falls on deaf ears.

I'm not trolling, I'm genuinely a bit bemused by the pat objections.

Anonymous said...

no surprise there - Tesco would also target a new site close to Brockley station - and a developer wouldn't say no

Brockley Nick said...

Not really "close" to Brockley Station is it? I mean, not close enough to capitalise on the footfall coming from the station. People coming out of Brockley have Costcutter and Nisa right there in terms of chain supermarkets. the crowds dissipate after about 100 yards.

It'll be aimed at people living in and around Crofton Park station.

Anonymous said...

Crofton Park yet again leading the charge when it comes to Good, Honest Fare. I solute them!

CPR said...

Here are the planning app details that were turned down.

http://acolnet.lewisham.gov.uk/LEWIS-XSLPagesDC/acolnetcgi.exe?ACTION=UNWRAP&RIPNAME=Root.PgeDocs&TheSystemkey=63320

Brockley Nick said...

Sorry, slight correction, this will not be aimed at people living IN Crofton Park Station.

Anonymous said...

If there's a Tesco and Sains at Honor Oak Park, can we have a Waitrose at Brockley? :-)

CPR said...

where would the sansburys at honor oak go? Did I miss a BC story?

Anonymous said...

I am in brockley and we do go to budg they are so friendly and professional. Can't stand the Spar which is physically 50mtres from my house... long live Budgen and his people

Mung the merciless said...

"The supermarket chain Budgens = good, the supermarket chain Tesco = evil. I'm not overly enthused by small supermarkets populating high streets but I've yet to see how people discriminate when dummy spitting...is it a knee jerk yah boo?"

The Budgens in Crofton Park is owned by Jay. He's very popular locally and it's a friendly shop with great range of stock - well priced. The staff are very helpful and pleasant. So for a major supermarket to open opposite a popular business built up through hard work over years does seem a bit greedy.

I don't know why you have to accuse anyone who doesn't agree with you with being guilty of childlike behaviour. May be just make your point rather than just insulting anyone with an opposing point of view? That would be refreshing...

Anonymous said...

I'm not acussing anyone of being childish, your being overly sensitive as is so often the case when discussing supermarkets. Budgens is a franchise model, they do not just buy the name they buy into its supply chain that uses scale to provide cheaper groceries. Budgens will be cheaper than many small corner shops. Yes he is a nice chap, I use it regularly. No doubt the people who manage and will work in Tescos will be nice people so not sure what your point is. For every pound you spend aortion will go to the budgen behemoth, so again why is supporting Budgens fine but tesco not? You may well find some of your pension fund tied up with them. Shops compete on price, convenience, range etc, etc not some nebulous concept of fairness. The little corner shop may have a view.

Why not answer the question? How big is too big as a chain? Broca has two bussinesses, is that a shop too far?

Anonymous said...

Not to mention that Tesco is also "popular business built up through hard work over years".

D said...

Jay is a legend. He will crush Tesco like a bug.

Anonymous said...

I imagine Tesco aim to be profitable in this location by taking custom from other local stores, mostly Budgens. I sense that Budgens has a built a good level of local support and I hope that this loyalty remains when, as seems inevitable, Tesco undercuts some of the prices, for a time at least. I enjoy shopping in the Budgens and intend to keep choosing them when I'm up that way.

Anonymous said...

Budgens is a franchise yes...owned by a local family who have owned a food store on that site long before they bought the franchise....

Anonymous said...

I hope this helps get more people out ot the high street, rather than damaging some of the great local businesses.

It's not just Budgens and Co-Op under threat, Peter James and Mr Lawrence will probably be hurt as well. Hopefully their customer bases will be loyal enough to survive (and I think they are).

Anonymous said...

So we've apparently established that it is indeed a franchise and presumably he recognises that buying into a franchise enables him to take advantage of their supply chain and marketing. Evil? Or simply a commercial decision? Should I shop only on the basis of of the alledged niceness of the staff? Still not sure why there is a massive difference that means I should chain myself to the railings. What about liddle? Or a non British supermarket chain? Sounds like self reinforcing hysteria, remeber a few years ago when supermarkets were pilloried for abandoning the high street for out of town superstores so killing the high street? Actually fairly neutral, everyone uses supermarkets because it's a model that the consumer finds useful.

Anonymous said...

In my experience with Tesco Metros they have the odd loss leader to get you through the door, but then it's quiet expensive, they usually have hardly any of their own brand just the big brand names. So I don't think it'll massively cheaper anyway.

Who does all their shopping from convenience stores and complains about the price anyway? If you want cheap go to a big supermarket.

Anonymous said...

The bird nest thread is suddenly looking more interesting after reading the comments on this one!

Brockley Nick said...

"hould I shop only on the basis of of the alledged niceness of the staff?"

I'd say that customer service is a very good reason to shop somewhere. Not that it's a moral decision though - I agree with the general thrust of the point you're making.

Anonymous said...

Mr Laurences used to be rammed back in the day, went there recently and it was empty. Guess the extra competition from Jam Circus and others have taken its business.

Brockley Realist said...

I have always gone with whoever has the cheapest fare and will continue to do so.

comerford rd said...

@ anon15.18
I'd argue that Peter James and Mr Lawrence will probably get more more custom than less, with more footfall in the area.

Anonymous said...

Does this mean the honest DIY shop on that space has closed? :-(

i like big butts said...

Brockley Cross could do with some better shops too.

Pull your finger out Tesco or Pizza Express.

Anonymous said...

Sorry but hasn't the building been demolished and the planning app for redevelopment been turned down?

Anonymous said...

A KFC would also go nicely in Brockley Cross.

Anonymous said...

http://www.rightmove.co.uk/commercial-property-for-sale/property-34367203.html

Restaurant space for sale in Brockley Cross ;-)

Anonymous said...

anon 17.01

the DIY shop closed a long time ago - was replaced by a window company who since relocated locally.

Darylh said...

Budgens rocks. As for tesco, every little hurts.

Andy said...

It's all about the Broca ... 6 eggs for a £1, fresh bread, real choice.

Anonymous said...

Lotta love for Budgens and Jay - which I share. Yet another supermarket franchise seems a bit pointless. Cannot see me switching.

Anonymous said...

It really isn't "all about the Broca"...

Costcutter boycotter said...

I really don't know why everyone raves about the Broca. Been in there a few times hoping to treat myself to something nice for my tea , rather than go to costcutter with its ignorant , rude staff , only to find the produce very "bitty" in that I couldn't seem to cobble together anything to make a full meal . The veg and fruit look old and past it too.

Anonymous said...

Don't get me started on the staff in Costcutter . Unbelievably rude .

Anonymous said...

Re: Brockley Nick's comment, 21 May 2012 13:56 re: 'I don't think it will cause congestion. It's a small supermarket, designed for shoppers on foot.'
In last year's planning application the developer was seeking to impose traffic/waiting restrictions to Sevenoaks Road/Brockley Hall Road so that these roads could be used by HGVs! So not only would the development cause congestion, but road safety concerns too – the roads in question are quiet residential streets.
Nick, why are you scare-mongering about this planning application site if you are not prepared to reveal your source or indicate how you know this information about the 15-year lease?

Brockley Nick said...

Yes, fair point about HGVs. That is key to their model for these stores and why I always felt that the Mantle Road site would not work for the likes of Tesco.

So yes, it would mean more lorries and that's in itself a negative.

But once again I refer you to the precedent on Lewisham Way, which also relies on regular HGV deliveries and which does not noticeably create congestion problems.

As for "scaremongering". I'm not doing any such thing. I'm just reporting the news. My "source" hasn't given me permission to name them, so I am respecting their confidentiality - and I have given you the caveat that this is only single sourced.

Barbara said...

How can they sign a lease when the building doesn't even exist yet, and no planning permission has been given for the new building? If it is true, I'll never set a foot in it out of loyalty to Budgens. And I'm also boycotting Jam Circus - the owners claim to care about locals but their development of this site has been shameful.

kolp said...

I can see a Tesco express working there, but I'd be disappointed.

Yes it is a form of snobbishness - that would cause the disappointment, snobby in that, so far SE4 has plowed its own furrow. I like the quirky independence of the area, we haven't got major chains here.

But what will be, will be...

Anonymous said...

Another +1 for Broca food market - LOVE. (hope it extends even further!)

Tamsin said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Tamsin said...

Come late to this answering the Anon around 2pm yesterday...
Budgens (though a franchise) = good because although cashing in on the supply chain and image franchise holders are by and large independent small business people who work hard for their local reputation. Also not much marketing, when did you last see a Budgens ad on TV?
Tesco = evil because they and Sainsburys have fought themselves to a stand-off on out-of-town sites and are now moving their battlefield to the small local convenience market and the casualties will be small struggling local franchise holders and - as mentioned above - specialist shops like butchers and bakers. Tesco are especially evil because of the excessive data capture (which they are not fully open about). Also their really agressive marketing - awesomely effective opportunism, a sponsored ad on the weather forecast pages in the unexpected snowfall the winter before last directing people to their nearest Tesco express, maybe two miles away. The fact that someone's nearest shop was probably a convenience store just round the corner was immaterial - Tesco were exploiting their marketing muscle and the unusual situation under the guise of being helpful.

Anonymous said...

@Tamsin. What is it with this "excessive data capture" stuff you crack out every time it comes to Tesco. Every single retailer in the world does exactly the same. It is also not some brutally evil thing Tesco does with the weather. It is a feature Google offers, that Tesco amongst about a million other companies use.

I support local independent businesses, but please get real. It's life. There is nothing stopping the local convenience store doing exactly the same and paying the same amount of money for the ads and having access to the same data.

Tamsin said...

No way a small convenience store could compete on a level playing field. I expect it was a much as they could do to get into work that day! Tesco's marketing department undoubtedly had the campaign planned in advance - having the facilities to do so - and so were able to immediately slot in the ad (within the weather.co.uk site, not coming up alongside the way google ads do) complete with the link to the supporting store search data-base. Also a strategy that could only work for a national organisation - no point people in Birmingham being told they are 50 miles from a shop in Northampton.

Yes, small retailers do "data capture" but on a friendly and human scale - the shop-keepers know you and remember what you usually buy. Impressive and flattering stuff. I do not like the idea of a card linked to a computer analysing my weekly shop and then sending me falsely personal e-mails telling me what they have that I should buy next.

Anonymous said...

@Tamsin. Don't talk about stuff you don't know about. Ads on the weather.com site are buyable through the Google Ad Network. It is a case of whowever pays the most per click gets the adview (no different to the Ads you see on Brockley Central).

A local convenience store could in fact do a cleverer ad than the one you've described Tesco doing. All they have to do is specifically target users in a certain region (they can even draw it on a map to include the few roads they want if they so desire) and have an ad linking direct to their website. No need to even have a store search and no need to target people in Brockley for their Crofton Park store if they don't want to, let alone your Northampton and Birmingham example. This would also actually be cheap to do.

By the way, about those cards storing the data that you don't like. If you don't like them - don't use them. The reason you use them is to get points and discounts. If you were annoyed enough, you'd give up your discounts. Oh and those emails - you can unsubscribe you know?

Anonymous said...

Any reason my comment got removed?

Brockley Nick said...

Not removed, blocked by Google (probs because you were talking about google ads). Now unblocked. I agree with everything you say.

Tim said...

I don't understand how this blocking works. If it was blocked by Google, how does it manage to shunt its way between anons complaint of its removal and your explanation that Google 'blocked' it. Surely it would appear after Anons complaint and/or your response?

Brockley Nick said...

No, when it is posted, it carries a time stamp, even if it gets sent to the "spam" folder. When I unblock it, it gets reinserted back in to the stream of comments at the time it was posted (before the complaint about its "removal"). No mystery.

Danja said...

It takes some serious spin to warp time like that - true skillz Nick.

Tamsin said...

OK - I am corrected and enlightened about the way the ads work. (And because I have raised the issue so is everyone else - so don't get too despairing about me, Nick...) Let's hope some of the local stores read this on BC and consider doing cleverer ads as you suggest. I was just so startled by the speed and efficiency of it.

FYI I don't use Tesco - where I need the range that the big supermarkets offer Sainsbury's is marginally cheaper on a big shop and Asda much cheaper - if you're not wanting pernickety stuff like strong flour. And I've probably cut off my nose to spite my face in that I don't do Nectar points either - used to be registered but then needed to re-register for some reason and just too much hassle, although I've probably lost out significantly. But I also have never been personally hassled by the e-mails.

Brockley Nick said...

Every business that relies on more than just passing trade should get itself a website and build its presence on Facebook and Twitter. It is crazy not to.

Websites are cheap (or free) and social media is free to do. They should also talk to the editors of local sites like this one and get active on local forums like SEC. There's a lot you can do before you even have to think about advertising.

Brockley Market is a perfect example - it has 2775 followers on Twitter - that's a direct link in to the brains of 2775 people, mostly locals, so they can excite them about every new thing happening at the market. They're also on Facebook, have created a dedicated thread on SEC and plug themselves very effectively to local (and London media), keeping us informed about what's new and interesting.

It's no coincidence that they built a regular customer base very quickly. And of course, what they have to offer is very good, so people keep coming back.

Anonymous said...

Have I missed something. I thought the council turned down the planning application. Is this another example of Lewisham Council rolling over?

Holunder said...

Jay's Budgens is the best local supermarket I have been to - me and my kids love walking there - it's not too big - but still has an excellent choice.

Prob more expensive than the big supermarkets - but still has good offers and Tesco price match.

I find the Tesco Express shops really soulless - the stock is so limited I struggle finding things for a fresh meal.

In response to Anonymous 21st May 14.54 "No doubt the people who manage and will work in Tescos will be nice people so not sure what your point is."

That's just not the case as there will be hardly any people there - probably just one - as the rest is just self service check outs. The big supermarket staff in my experience usually have v limited interaction with the customers - I have never experienced any staff as friendly as in Budgens in any other local supermarket. If you own your own business - you often have more pride in what you do.

The thing is local businesses generate more for the local economy - such as jobs.

I hope people will stay loyal to Budgens but it will be hard for them with another big chain opposite.

No Love from Jay said...

Bring on Tesco's! I can't understand this love in with Budgen's. I have used the shop every week for a year and rarely get more than a grunt from the staff. I frequently get hurried through the tills until it is time to hand over the change when I am left standing there while the cashier has some critical exchange with another worker with my cash in his hand. I always say thank you and am rarely acknowledged.
I can only presume that people who love this place so much have never seen a real neighborhood store.
And the bags of bananas are always wet.
So there.

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