Black Books
Lewisham Council is consulting on its plans to close a substantial proportion of its libraries. Sydenham, Blackheath, Crofton Park, Grove Park and New Cross are all on the closure list. That's 5 - Lewisham has 12 in total. Therefore just under HALF of the council's libraries are set to be closed.
The council calls this 're-shaping service delivery'.
BC remains to be convinced of the rationale for this move. We look forward to hearing from the council in more detail about this proposal.
Many thanks to Transpontine and Blackheath Bugle for picking up on this story and bringing it to our attention.
62 comments:
I wouldn't be one to say libraries are over but are they as important as they once were? Just saying.... [ puts on tin hat]
Well if Crofton Park library closes, I am out of this area. Final straw. Not a huge threat I know, but god this place sometimes.
Tend to feel closing libraries is a bit like burning books. Has the idea been to run them into the ground until nobody uses them? I use the Lewisham one all the time and it's always v busy (realise that's not on the list, but just an example). Can't believe there aren't a lot of people in New Cross etc who need access to computers, etc, and who do, you know, read.
Maybe we could ask Fred Goodwin for a donation seeing as it's his arsey behaviour that is giving the likes of Bullock justification in this sort of garbage.
Worth noting that this is less than one of 42 pages of possible spending cuts by Lewisham Council in the document Kate's linked to.
On the library front, they say:
"Service co-location, community management and asset transfer are all being considered as part of these proposals."
Community management could be an interesting idea, as could using the library to deliver other useful (and appropriate) front-line services.
Community management of the library?. I'd like to help but my hands are full what with running the local free school.
All rather depressingly predictable. Back in 2008-9 there was a 'Mayor's Commission on Libraries and Learning' in Lewisham and you can find the report on the Council's website. One of the most interesting points in it, I think, is that library use in Lewisham has been going up in the past couple of years, bucking the trend of the previous decade when it declined. If we're serious about using less of the world's resources, cutting CO2 etc, then expanding the role of libraries is one useful strand towards this.
Crofton Park library (built in 1905, not listed as far as I know) is one of my favourite local buildings, and one of the Carnegie libraries - not quite as grand as the one in Herne Hill, but lovely none the less. The upstairs is completely derelict, but used to be a caretaker's/librarian's flat I believe - potential to bring that back into use for meeting room/classroom or smthg). The senior librarian there (her name escapes me right now) has worked for Lewisham's Library Service for over 30 years and is absolutely passionate about her work. She's recently been working to get the small space to the rear of the library in use as a garden, for children's story telling sessions in the good weather etc. I would hate to see her (or other library staff for that matter) made redundant. The 8 computers are always in use when I go there, and it's very popular with families after school. They don't always have the books I'm after, but you can order them in. They run a good range of activities for children in the school holidays too.
Happy to chain myself to the railings if LBL try to close this - any other takers for a spot of direct action?!
Yup Sue - I'll be with you on this one. Getting a library book once a week as a kid was a treat and made me into an avid reader..
I'll be with you on the railings, Sue! This would be a tragedy.
Its easy to get people to oppose library closures, it is less easy to actually get them using their local library.
Do we really need so many small libraries across the Borough? I'd rather have 3-5 well stocked, good IT, large libraries with professional leadership in the North South, East & West (& possibly also Centre) of the borough, coupled with a good outreach service to the elderly and those less mobile.
Let's see lots of numpties chained up - we can go and throw things at them.
Look - as individuals, as a community, as a council and even as a country, we are living beyond our means.
It's all well and good wanting all this stuff but no one has actually been prepared to pay for it.
The problem with libraries is that most don't really do anything the private sector doesn't do more than adequately.
Want a book? Go to Waterstones, Tesco, Oxfam or Amazon. Want a DVD? That'll be Love Film. And there are plenty of Internet cafes.
Libraries aren't well used and most of those who use them can afford not to have their hobbies subsidised by the taxpayer. Those who can't afford it probably could if they spent less of their benefits on cigarettes, Stella and getting their 6 children's ears pierced.
Axing libraries would mean fewer librarians but then it may mean increased book sales. So perhaps that means more work in the wealth creating private sector instead. Though the librarians would lose the ridiculous and unsustainable benefits state workers of all descriptions get.
Also the council is planning to keep 6 libraries. So if you really are too poor for the alternatives then you just have to walk half a mile further anyway. That'll improve your health and save the health service money. And if you can't walk, there's dial-a-ride.
So really there is no issue here other than a few middle class do gooders who are outraged they may have to buy books occasionally rather than leach off the rest of us.
Get used to it. I have faith the coalition government will get rid of all the ridiculous state fat we are forced to pay for.
Shame to lose crofton park, or any other libraries. Yes, people can at times buy their own books, but that is not the only service the library provides. It is of particular use for the young people in the community for a place to go, to use IT facilities and borrow as many books as they like. Books are hardly cheap to buy these days, and its ok if you only read occassionaly, but as a child I would read 3/4 books a week - a very expensive habit.
I would prefer my taxpayers money is spent on providing books to the community than many other things.
@Lou
Are those people buying stella and cigarettes on benefits because they didn't read as children? Maybe they didn't have access to a Library...
Simplistic argument? Yeah, just like yours...
If I was an astute politician I'd let this story be splashed acrossed the media, while I quietly make significant cuts to child care and other important services.
Then in a blaze of publicity created by my foes I become a public hero announcing I have 'saved' the libraries and at the same time 'save' the Blackheath fireworks display.
This would justify spending thousands of pounds having a cabinet member for communication and strategy.
I think as much as anything local libraries are a symbol of community and for that reason alone I think they're well worth protecting.
Lou, it's lovely that you can afford to buy a book whenever you want to, but you should bear in mind that a lot of people aren't so lucky. Convenient library access is thus a vital service for them.
I agree with anon 09.39. Protecting and reinventing, if necessary. On the SE23 Forum I read with disbelief as someone on there complained that libraries were sometimes used to conduct job interviews. I think that is a fine use for Libraries, which need to diversify (and have) as their core role of book lending becomes less important in the internet age.
Sue's post suggests that there is scope to do much more with CP library - both in the garden and the first floor. So if asset transfer or community management meant that its potential was fully exploited, then it could be a good thing.
But simply to close it would be madness, especially at a time when so many people are out of work.
Well Lou the war in Afghanistan has cost far in excess of £2.5bn. We could have bought a lot of books for that.
I suggest people look at other proposals for 'efficiencies' which are more likely to happen.
In some cases the document spells out the direct impact those choses will have on communities and the day to day lives of those not in a position to afford to buy books.
Some schools have already prepared a deficit budget for coming years.
Well Lou the war in Afghanistan has cost far in excess of £2.5bn. We could have bought a lot of books for that.
At a guess, far more books than the Taliban would allow to be printed and definately no music CDs.
I just think the cuts should be targeted first at the information campaigns and government publications and departmental mouse mats and the quangos and the designers who are paid to come up with logos and the sometimes competing (non useful) websites and the image consultants and all the other useless twaddle that just seems to be departments and commissions spending budgets to justify their existence and to make sure they keep the budget for the next year.
I'm sure loads of useful work does get done and I have no problem with spending money on useful campaigns/ publications but the expenditure needs to be kept realistic, targeted and in proportion.
I've got no idea whether enough money could be saved but point is Libraries do an obvious good but branded pens and logos do not.
Rant over.
Doubt that will make a dent, it's an understandable rant but i susspect it would not stand up to scrutiny.
We waste £6bn a year in Afghanistan in order to buy influence in Washington. We don't influence the Yanks very well because we don't properly commit ourselves to the fight against the Taliban. The result is that the Americans do what they believe is best for them.
What is best for us is to keep libraries open so that all parts of society can access them. The great American benefactor, Carnegie, was right. The foundation gave us these institutions for free and it is madness to close so many just when we need people to read more not less.
Anyone relating libraries to life under the taliban needs to get their head firmly away from their not very well educated behind.
Libraries, education, health... our kids and our dispossessed need this stuff or else they will not have the opportunity to critically evaluate why we go to war in far flung parts of the world.
Personally I would rather have a smaller civil service, a larger number of potholes and more taxes.
Lou clearly just trying to rile people so I refuse to be annoyed. Just to say, we do not all have money to buy books and use internet cafes, and libraries are also a very very important de facto community centre for many unemployed people and pensioners. And since cuts must be made, let's hope they have more imagination than to cut one of the proudest British inventions, something that has been doing good for more than 100 years and which has been an example to the world and that we would never ever get back. This council area already has shamefully few libraries, anyway.
Well now that the ELL is running and proving a valuble addition to the area, Lou has to have something else to be appalled at.
Lou ...
Are you George Osbourne in disguise?
Anon 10.49: There is no answer to that - quite simply there are too many people in this country and not enough work for them all to do. The place would run quite happily if a quarter of people sat around and did nothing. So many jobs now are created purely to give people things to do, but that's just life.
Why have large buildings to house books...why not a digital service?
Carnegie Libraries....
"One of the requirements was the willingness of people and government to raise taxes to support the library."
Now there's an idea.
Digital service, great. So everyone will be given free broad band, a pc and a mobile reader. Kindle or iPad?
Anon @11:40 great theory, did you thunk it all by yourself?
Anons @ 10:49 and 11:40. Yes. The sad part being that it might be easier to lose and find a new departmental mouse mat designer than a good and comitted librarian.
Hold on Sigh... I just need to nip to the library to try and work out what your point is. Back soon.
Figures released by the Valuation Office Agency last month showed that since 1997 there has been a 1,150% rise in the number of lap-dancing clubs in Britain, and a 6% decline in the number of libraries
Figures released by the Valuation Office Agency last month showed that since 1997 there has been a 1,150% rise in the number of lap-dancing clubs in Britain, and a 6% decline in the number of libraries
Libraries are not just for books lending.
They are used by people trying to improve themselves through self education.
They are also a distribution point for community information. They are the place people learn about what is going on in their own community. They are usually one of the few council services are widely appreciated and reach the most impoverished sections of society.
I think you can tell a lot about a local government by the strength of its libraries.
Lewisham has a short sighted, phillistine attitude and this is an example.
Are these Libraries going to be turned into Bookies like a lot of closed buildings.
To be honest I'm not surprised at the proposal to close the new cross one as it has very short irregular opening hours as it is and doesn't seem very well used. I am surprised at the crofton park one, whenever I go there there are always quite a few people using the computers/reading etc. The music sessions for babies/children are always very well attended and a good local free resource for those who can't afford the paid for classes. The children's section has lots of choice and it would be a real shame if it closed down.
From a Guardian interview with Margaret Hodge last March...
Starbucks' UK MD Darcy Willson-Rymer, who argues that the best way to save libraries is to put coffee shops in them, as they have in the US.
She told me that running a successful public library in the 21st century is tough. Technological advances and higher expectations of service mean that libraries must, in her glum progressivist phrase, "move with the times to stay part of the times". "I do care passionately about libraries," she says, "but they have to change. The footfall is down and book issues are massively down. Only 14 of 151 local authorities have libraries that offer ebooks."
They have been running down a lot of the libraries in Lewisham for years. Even the one in central Lewisham offers a service that is a pale shadow of what it used to be.
Some statistics on Lewisham library use.
http://www.librarylondon.org/localgroups/lewisham/lewisham.htm
Lou - have you been to a Library? Go to Crofton Park at 11am on a Friday and then tell me no one uses them.
What a terrible shame, the Crofton Park libary is one of the focal points of the area, and closing it would mean the inevitable years of dereliction, or worse even demoliton of a fine old building.
And so goes the regeneration of Lewisham down the swanny, to save a handful of sheckles.
Sigh.
Yes I'm sure Crofton Park library is rammed full of yummy mummies and their sprogs at 11 on a Friday.
They then head off for coffee and a cake at a nice local eatery before trundling back to their modernised Victorian homes and expensive kitchens.
The point is that these people don't need to borrow books - and they don't need it subsidised by taxpayers.
Libraries are a very middle class thing. With the best will in the world the benefit layabouts with 19 kids do not spend much time at the library. If you want to help THEIR kids you do it by giving them books. Actual books - not money the parents can spend on booze and fags instead.
Like swimming pools, libraries are not an essential service and as we have to make cuts we should expect them to go.
Incidentally any of the outraged middle classes are
more than welcome to set up their own library. Charge a monthly membership fee if you genuinely think there's enough interest - which there isn't.
Oh, and the prune who made the suggestion
that I'd rather our money was spent in Afghanistan than on libraries, erm no. Lou would scrap trident, slash the size of the armed forces to a minimum and spend the savings on education. And transport.
We need to get away from this notion that councils/the government should do everything.
The state is fundamentally inept and should do as little as possible.
Lou - what would still exist if you were given the chance to run the borough your way? By the time you've done away with libraries, cafes, railways and swimming pools (I'm assuming this list is far from exhaustive?) what are the good people of lewisham meant to do with their time?
Great idea, the private sector took over the tube maintenance and refurbishment. Hows that going by the way?
"....If you want to help THEIR kids you do it by giving them books...."
Or lend them books with a fine if they don;t return them. Cheaper and a better use of the resource. We could call them 'Libraries'
Lou - why should the government provide education or transport? Those are two areas where the private sector already provide services, it's been a long time since there were private libraries?
The government should provide education and transport because these are crucial and the private sector would not be able to make a profit out of the areas and people that need them most.
Likewise the Post Office - and the crazy ideas to privatise that.
Monkeyboy:
Cost of operating library roughly £150,000....that could buy 10,000 books a year for brockley alone, which could then be posted out to each household with a child.
Alternatively fund school libraries with some of the savings.
Don't we need to know how much needs to be saved to make an informed decision?
So every child get "a" book? Great.
Libraries middle class? Since when?
Usually they are full of young school students who have no place to study at home. Pensioners, mothers and younger children. They have a wide client base, especially from the less well off sections of society.
I used libraries very extensively in my youth until I went to university and became middle class. Now I go to bookshops, drink skinny lattes and jiggle my eyebrows at yummy mummies. A different sort of thing altogether.
Libraries are for people who cannot afford to buy books but would nontheless like to read and study.
Running them down and closing them is a false economy.
Instead they should expand to provide deskspace and computers for small start up companies. With a nice business reference section for doing market research.
During an economic downturn, libraries are a crucial community resource. If anything they should be expanding their range of services.
terrible news and a damning inditement of this Labour council!
This is terrible news. I hope there is still scope for the Council to reconsider. I regularly use the Crofton Park Library and also have had gone weekly over the last year with my baby to take books out for her on her own card. As Sue said, it's a wonderful Carnegie building and it seems a shame to cut the borough's libraries so drastically. The borough will be much impoverished for it. The activities for babies and toddlers are standing room only. I don't see how they can make the case that the library doesn't serve the community extremely well.
It's not surprising that culling some libraries was proposed, as mentioned the New Cross one seems to be more closed than open. The type of service it offers, seems to be from a different era. So i think it's a change or die thing for that one.
As for Crofton Park I honestly don't think that will be going anywhere.
But even if it was, it's not the people are going to do anything to stop it closing. They'll moan the move onto to the next story.
I'm with Nick on this. Community areas are on the decline, spaces that people can mix in. Pubs are closing at an unprecedented speed. Libraries should be valued but perhaps they need a little tweaking and re-inventing. OK, so many people get info they need from Wikipedia or they buy their own books, but surely there are other uses libraries can be put to other than simple repositories for books. Much as I love the art scene in our area, I think it's a great shame that Lewisham BC saw fit to shut the magnificent Carnegie library on Lewisham Way.
Spare a thought for another fine Carnegie building at Sydenham, which because of its relative remoteness from the boroughs centre, and the makeup of the area, fulfills a great need.
Does Lewisham have some policy against these fine old buildings?
Here is the little gem. Check out the cupolas and arches.
I love the idea that a child can get by on a book a year- obviously no kids. I buy books and use the library a lot as I read a lot - 4-5 books a week which I could not afford to purchase. Also different libraries hold different books and if you are a book nut, Lewisham Central library is going to run out of books you like pretty quick.
Philistines! I don't use libraries any more (instead my house is groaning under the weight of several thousand books that I own) but as a child I used to get eight books out of my local library every three weeks and I would have been devastated if it had been closed down. I probably learned as much from those books as I did at school.
Closure of libraries sounds like a terrible idea, and a retrograde step and I should be happy to demonstrate, sign petitions etc. Just point me in the right direction.
Karen Jonason writes:
As soon as I read that Crofton Park library was one of 5 under threat of closure I set up an e-petition: http://ipetitions.com/petition/savecroftonparklibrary/
So far a local writer has signed it and another famous one who researched for her original books at this library, is likely to. I have also started paper petitions. 8 local businesses so far have agreed to take petition sheets and post a notice in their windows, in the space of 10 minutes. I could have got more, but ran out of sheets! I will produce more and continue to put them into local businesses
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